Bernie Borges [00:00:00]:
Kevin Bradley, welcome to the Life Fulfilled podcast.
Kevin Bradley [00:00:04]:
Thank you so much, Bernie. It’s an honor and a pleasure being here.
Bernie Borges [00:00:07]:
Well, it’s an honor to have you. I’m looking forward to our conversation. Kevin, you are the Vice President of Culture and Belonging at Hub International, where you’re responsible for the oversight of talent, culture and community DEI strategy. And you’re focused on attracting the best diverse teams and. And talent so you can create and sustain a vibrant, inclusive culture. And for anybody who may not know, Hub International, you are a leading provider of very vital services. Employee benefits, risk insurance, retirement, private wealth for thousands and thousands of brands. Not the sexiest services, Kevin, but very vital services to any business.
Bernie Borges [00:00:51]:
And, Kevin, we are both speaking at the upcoming HR Leadership and Wellness Executive Summit, happening in October in Atlanta. Atlanta. And there’ll be more information on that a little bit later in this episode, but let’s get right to it. I invited you here to have a conversation around this concept of the evolution of belonging, how it’s been sort of an evolution from DEI to the evolution of belonging. And of course, you are the VP of Culture and Belonging at Hub International. So let’s begin with. What is that? What is your role? VP of Culture and Belonging to.
Kevin Bradley [00:01:27]:
So the role is pretty traditional in terms of what a lot of companies had in the past that I called it many things. Diversity, Diversity and inclusion. Inclusion and diversity. Inclusion. Diversity, Equity almost at some points became an Alphabet soup. But at Hub, we had the conversation that, at the end of the day, this is really about our culture, what we want to be as a culture. And a big part of that is we want all of our employees to feel that they belong. So we went from kind of a mouthful title, which at one point was diversity, Equity, Inclusion and Community.
Kevin Bradley [00:02:10]:
And rather than explaining words, we’re much more comfortable explaining our actions. And so we moved to culture and belonging to.
Bernie Borges [00:02:19]:
Okay, and you made mention of the. The Alphabet soup. So that was the DEIC acronym. Right. Diversity, Equity, Inclusion and community.
Kevin Bradley [00:02:27]:
Correct. And again, you’ll see many companies had more letters, different letters. It got very interesting for. For some time.
Bernie Borges [00:02:35]:
Right, right. Okay. All right. And then I know that you’ve made reference to sort of like a new culture. What do you mean by that?
Kevin Bradley [00:02:45]:
Well, actually, it’s not so much a new culture, and it’s. It’s interesting that the title of this podcast is Evolution, because. Just my opinion, but I think Human Beings need to Belong has been around since human beings have been around, and I think we’ve complicated things in this space sometimes, and I look at something I did with my fraternity when they formed a DEI committee and we went around and around and then someone had the brilliant idea of going back to the words of our founders and. And basically their simple model was creating better men for a better world. And so again, it’s not new, but I think it’s uncomplicating and unfettering things that we’ve known for some time and just making it make sense.
Bernie Borges [00:03:35]:
So if it’s not a new culture, then the one thing that I also know from our previous conversation is that sometimes there’s a little bit of a confusion over an overlap between the concept of culture and the concept of community. So you want to kind of speak to the distinction there.
Kevin Bradley [00:03:53]:
Sure. I think sometimes community, often in the corporate sense, often implies external outreach. And we do do that, of course, but you know, for us, community is, is getting our house in order, ensuring that we have a strong internal culture, while at the same time still being a good corporate citizen locally. So we have community engagement that goes on at almost every region that we have our leadership and our employees are good corporate citizens and they want our communities to be better places and if we can contribute to that, even better.
Bernie Borges [00:04:33]:
So I think what I hear you saying then, Kevin, is that they coexist. Right. Culture is internal. It’s about use the phrase, getting and keeping your house in order. So that’s an internal focus, whereas community is more external. Do I have that right?
Kevin Bradley [00:04:49]:
And I think community is a byproduct of your culture. You could have a company whose culture is almost like a King Midas, and, you know, I’m going to hoard my treasures. Or you could have a company whose culture is, you know what, we’re going to be a good place to work, but. But we’re also gonna be a good neighbor. People are going to want our offices in their community. So I think that they’re closely tied. But again, I think culture drives what kind of community based organization you are.
Bernie Borges [00:05:25]:
You know, the more time I spend in the HR community, the more I realized that they really just like technology. They, they have their own set of acronyms, Alphabet soup, as you, you like to say. And there’s another one that I remember we discussed, and that’s the acronym erg. I know what it stands for. Why don’t you speak to the meaning and the importance of ERGs?
Kevin Bradley [00:05:49]:
And again, they’re called many different things at many different companies. I’ve seen ERGs, Employee Resource Groups. That’s kind of the oldest acronym that’s been around and some have migrated to BRGs, business resource groups. I’ve seen dozens of other names. At the end of the day, again, these are communities within the community. These are, and the community again I’ll define as the company. So these are communities of like minded people. What I love about the way we do things, yes, we have a black or African American erg, but you know what, you don’t have to be black to be a part of it.
Kevin Bradley [00:06:27]:
They’re open to everybody. If you have an affinity, if you are just seeking knowledge, if you just want to network, that’s a lot of what these groups are around to do. So there are communities, they share their culture and knowledge with the rest of the company and just nice opportunities to network and engage internally.
Bernie Borges [00:06:50]:
Okay, great. I love that. And you know, we haven’t even mentioned my favorite F word fulfillment yet and we’re going to get to that a little bit deeper. But you’ve already reminded me of it in that last comment. And that’s just the opportunity to participate in these communities can really feed our fulfillment at so many different levels. But we’re going to talk more about that here shortly. Another thing that I know that is important to you is what you call work life harmony. And this starts to really get to that fulfillment connection.
Bernie Borges [00:07:23]:
Why don’t you unpack that for us, Kevin?
Kevin Bradley [00:07:26]:
Yeah, it’s fulfillment, it’s engagement, it’s belonging. And I think for many, many years companies employees have had this quest to have work life balance. And I was in a workshop and there was an instructor from West Point actually who said, you know, if you look at the word balance, that kind of connotates 50 50. And if you look at things in a real world sort of way, there’s no such thing as work life balance. It’ll never be 50 50. So he suggested something that he called work life harmony, which means that, you know what, I could go home today and tell my wife and family I’m going to be kind of a ghost for the next week or so because I’ve got these projects, they have hard deadlines, I, they’re critical and I’m going to be just nose to the grindstone the harmony comes in. I could have the same conversation at work and another week and tell my boss, you know, my kids on a traveling baseball team, I want to go see them play, I’ll answer my calls, but I’m not going to be glued to my desk. So that’s not 50 50.
Kevin Bradley [00:08:37]:
It’s not an even split, but it’s creating that harmony where everything and, you know, all those parts of your life are living in harmony. Not evenness, not. Not equality, but harmony.
Bernie Borges [00:08:50]:
Yeah, I agree. And this is definitely where we have a very strong connection to not just fulfillment in general, Kevin, but fulfillment across what, as you know, I call our five life pillars. Right. Health, fitness, career, relationships, and legacy. And this allows us to really have that harmony. Because, you know, I often encounter people who say, well, I’m doing really well in these two pillars and. And not so great in these other three. And then they just kind of downplay the other three as if they don’t.
Bernie Borges [00:09:21]:
They shouldn’t even be seeking harmony. We should all be seeking harmony. I’m not saying perfection. It’s not what I’m saying. I don’t think you’re saying that either. Right. But harmony so that you can experience fulfillment as you go about working hard on projects and then taking some time to spend with family, as you shared in your example.
Kevin Bradley [00:09:41]:
Yeah. And I think the other thing that happens sometimes is if we take your five key life billers, for example, you might have someone that says, bernie, I love that. I’m going to grasp that. And then they’re operating under the work life balance mantra, and they try to boil five oceans, which, you know, boiling one is impossible, and they try to boil five oceans and not working in a more harmonious way to be fulfilled.
Bernie Borges [00:10:08]:
Exactly. And, you know, that reminds me, Kevin, that just to comment on what I view fulfillment as, I know that I’ve got a number of new listeners joining the Life Fulfilled podcast, so they maybe have not heard me define it in the past. And for anybody who has heard me define it, you’re going to hear it again. And that is that fulfillment is a deeper emotion than happiness. It’s associated with achievement. And when we experience fulfillment in something, it could be a big achievement or a small achievement or somewhere in the middle, it gives us this sense of fulfillment. And in most cases, it’s immutable. So unlike happiness, which can be fleeting.
Bernie Borges [00:10:45]:
Hey, my favorite sports team won last night or lost last night, or whatever the case may be, it’s still a temporary happiness, whereas fulfillment is more permanent. And that really allows us to give us perspective as we’re working to achieve fulfillment to the extent that we can across the five pillars. I remember you shared a story with me, Kevin, if I can jog your memory on it, about how you had some erg, coffee chats and that resulted in you experiencing some of these fulfillment emotions.
Kevin Bradley [00:11:20]:
Yeah. And it’s some great examples of the difference between that moment of happiness and that much deeper feeling of fulfillment. Our employee groups have what we call coffee chats. And oftentimes it’s a speaker, either internal or external, talking about a different topic. And we’ve had a number of them. And you know, like any person who’s doing projects, I get happiness when the project is complete, when the work is done, and it went off hopefully flawlessly. But the fulfillment on a lot of these have come when I get a random email from an employee or they post on their social media saying, hey, my company hosted this coffee chat on XYZ Topic. And it was almost life changing for me.
Kevin Bradley [00:12:06]:
It made me feel so good. It was amazing. That’s in my mind where fulfillment comes in versus that moment of happiness. Because I completed a project and I.
Bernie Borges [00:12:19]:
Would even suggest that that moment of fulfillment, that’s immutable, right? Like, nothing can take that away from you.
Kevin Bradley [00:12:25]:
No. And you know, years ago, early in my career, I was a recruiter for a major airline and we had tons of requisitions that we had to fill. And like every good recruiter, my happiness came when I met my numbers fulfilled my requisitions. But I had so many fulfillment moments when I’d be at an airport and when you’re a recruiter and hiring hundreds and hundreds of people, unfortunately you don’t remember all or any of them. I’m at an airport one time going through a delay, and the customer service agent called my name and said, you probably don’t remember me, but X number of years ago you hired me as a reservationist and now I’m a behind the counter agent and I’m loving life, I’m traveling. Thank you so much. You can’t put a dollar sign on that kind of fulfilling moment.
Bernie Borges [00:13:17]:
Yeah, yeah, no, I hear you. I’ve had a few of those myself. And to your point, that moment of fulfillment, again, sorry to be redundant, but it’s immutable. You experienced that and nothing can take away that emotion of fulfillment in that moment. Okay, let’s move on because we’ve been talking about the role of culture, the role of belonging, and of course, in your world, as vice president of culture and belonging at Hub International, it’s a business. That’s your job, and it’s an important job. So let’s tie that to the business. You know, what are the business benefits of culture and belonging?
Kevin Bradley [00:13:55]:
Sure. And one thing I always talk about with my employee groups is that if you really want to simplify things, there are two things we want to be we want to be everyone’s broker of choice and we want to be great employees. Employer of choice. Right. And so what does that have to do with the business? Well, I obviously, I think if you’re the broker of choice, but leveraging the differences and the different cultures that are out there, and I’ll give an example, just looking at data, because everyone’s data driven. But I went to the census and found that in the United States over 60% of hotels, motels are owned by Asians. Little known fact, people just like people don’t know that McDonald’s are owned by franchisees, but hotels are. It could have Hyatt on the front door or a red roof in, but chances are it’s owned by an individual or a family.
Kevin Bradley [00:14:46]:
So taking the fact that 60% of the hotels are owned by Asians and the fact that we have a hospitality vertical, I went to our hospitality segment and introduced them to an association of Asian hotel owners, the Asian American Hotel owners Association, about 30,000 members. What a strategic move. And it’s not Skittles and unicorns or illegal dei. It’s being in the face of our business and Looking at potential 30,000 potential new clients in the Hispanic market. We did the kind of the same thing. And again, going to the census and going to hard data, we found that There are almost 60,000 Hispanic owned construction companies in the United States. Why would you not want to serve them? Why would you not want to be relevant to them? And something I’ve learned along the way is that it’s not always about the best price, product or service, but you have to develop what I’ve seen called intercultural iq. Knowing that culture, knowing how to do business in that culture.
Kevin Bradley [00:15:54]:
I remember at one company before we sent people to Latin America, we told them, please don’t do the American thing and just start talking business right away. Be prepared that you may have to focus on family and have kind of personal discussions before businesses even discussed sending people to Japan. In particular, being cognizant of their very polite and indirect communication style. Again, in the United States, if you just look at the numbers, we’re a multicultural company. So I read over and over again and saw a gentleman give presentations a number of times because I never get tired of them. But a gentleman named Fons Trompenars who wrote a book called Riding the Waves of Culture. It’s a fascinating read.
Bernie Borges [00:16:39]:
You know Kevin, as I’m listening to you storytelling, give those examples and point out this concept. I love this concept of intercultural iq. It occurs to Me that in your role as VP of Culture and belonging at Hub International, you’re an advisor. You are advising different parts of the business on ways for them to engage and operate and optimize business opportunities by being intercultural, intelligent and aware so that their engagement and their behavior is well received and it’s good for the business.
Kevin Bradley [00:17:20]:
Well, and you made me think about something else. And it’s not, you know, I, I don’t pretend to know everything about every culture. Which is the beauty. I think one of the untapped opportunities with these employee resource groups or business resource groups or whatever you’re calling them. How many companies, Bernie, do you know that will pay for focus groups? You know, we want to know what fill in the blank community is thinking about this potential product. And let’s do a test run of this commercial. Let’s see what they think. Well, guess what? You’ve got focus groups working for you.
Kevin Bradley [00:17:54]:
Why not leverage them? Ask your employees if you’re trying to, if you’re trying to sell to Hispanic owned construction companies, why not ask the Latinos and Latinas working for you. What resonates with these folks? Do you know anybody? Can you open some doors for us? It’s crazy to me that this doesn’t happen more often.
Bernie Borges [00:18:13]:
Yeah, that’s a great point. Thank you for sharing that. You also talk about allyship as upstanding, so why don’t you unpack that? Let’s begin with, what do you mean by allyship first and how it’s upstanding?
Kevin Bradley [00:18:29]:
Well, so again, a lot of people will look at, let’s take. If you have an Asian American resource group and someone says, well, I’m not Asian, I want to be part of that group. And the group’s very welcoming, as I said. But then the next question is, I don’t know how to be a good ally. How do I join this group without being insulting or looking like I’m not sincere? And I think the first thing is be honest. You know, admit to knowing what you don’t know or not knowing what you don’t know. And then the other thing is when you see something that is not right, the question that one of my mentors always ask me is, are you an upstander when you see those situations or are you just a bystander? So again, I think one of the keys to being an ally, one of the challenges to being an ally is being that upstander. It’s easy to be.
Kevin Bradley [00:19:23]:
It’s easy to be a bystander and kind of click your tongue and say, boy, that shouldn’t have happened. But being an upstander, that is a challenge.
Bernie Borges [00:19:32]:
So an upstander is, is sort of like someone who’s supportive, someone who’s like an ally. Right.
Kevin Bradley [00:19:38]:
And who will speak up in a safe way, but obviously will speak up and not just let things happen in front of him or her.
Bernie Borges [00:19:45]:
So you probably come across this following thought pretty often in your role as VP of Culture and belonging. And that is people innocently saying something that is a mistake. How do you handle that?
Kevin Bradley [00:20:01]:
The wonderful gift of language and sayings and slogans and mottos. It’s happened to me. I remember years ago, I was in a team meeting and had a boss, nice guy. The meeting was not going very well and he just said, look, we need to take a timeout. This meeting is falling apart. It’s going off like a Chinese fire drill. Well, I don’t know if you know this about me, but I’m half Chinese. I grew up in Chicago’s Chinatown and I thought he knew that about me, maybe he didn’t.
Kevin Bradley [00:20:31]:
But anyway, so we’re on our little break and I pull him aside in the hallway and, you know, one of my methods of dealing with things is always giving the person grace first. So I didn’t go and wag a finger at him, but I went up to him and I said, boss, kind of have a question for you. I’m confused. You said, our meeting’s going off like a Chinese fire drill. I went to an all Chinese grade school. We had fire drills all the time. And I don’t recall any of them going badly. And he was a little speechless in the moment, became very apologetic, and I stopped him right there and I said, not looking for an apology, just looking to raise your awareness.
Kevin Bradley [00:21:08]:
Think about, you know, words are powerful. Think about the things that you’re saying. He said, it’s just something I used to hear as a kid. And, you know, I just say it. I said, well, you know, take a moment, take a breather, think about these things. Because words are powerful. They can be uplifting or they can be hurtful.
Bernie Borges [00:21:24]:
Yeah, euphemisms oftentimes can. Well, not often, but sometimes can get us in trouble. I think that’s a good example. Thank you. What about disability inclusion? You know, it’s something that I’m always sensitive to, but I don’t wear an HR hat. So I’m wondering, how do you address that?
Kevin Bradley [00:21:42]:
You know, I address it like a 500 pound elephant in the room. Because too many people even going back to the early part of our conversation, when we talk about diversity, a lot of people sometimes are not inclusive. You know, they’ll talk about diversity, and they’re actually talking about race and gender. But when I talk about diversity, it’s race, it’s gender, it’s diversity of thought, it’s veteran status, it’s on and on and on. And diversity is all inclusive, and that includes disabilities. And it’s a community that often gets overlooked in our conversations, despite the fact that as, again, one of my. I’ve been so blessed with mentors. One of my early mentors who was deaf from birth, told an audience that everyone in the room is a mere act of God away from joining her club.
Kevin Bradley [00:22:34]:
I always held that close. And we continue to need to make our workplaces and our neighborhoods more accessible. I have a friend in a wheelchair that to this day has trouble getting into some restaurants and coffee shops. We’re not where we need to be. And we also need to not go to the extreme when people talk about we should open our doors and hire individuals with disabilities. Some people like to swing to an extreme and say, oh, my gosh, does that mean we have to hire blind pilots? No, you hire someone who can do the job with or without an accommodation. So, again, I’m a big proponent of including that community when we talk about diversity.
Bernie Borges [00:23:18]:
And what is Access Living?
Kevin Bradley [00:23:21]:
Access Living is an organization whose board that I currently am serving as board chair. It’s what’s called a Center for Independent Living. And as that title would connote, we fight for accessibility and for individuals with disabilities to be able to leave independent, fulfilled lives. We look at everything from our buses and bus terminals accessible. Are there enough curb cuts? Can a person get into a building with relative ease? And it’s just amazing. As we look at, we’re in the year 2025, and we still have opportunities in the workplace, even just opening our minds to the fact that individuals can do jobs. Companies have proven it. When I was with the airline, we had folks that we hired who were blind working in reservations because.
Kevin Bradley [00:24:11]:
Because they were great on the computer. So, again, I think it’s looking at the ability versus concentrating on the disability.
Bernie Borges [00:24:19]:
Yeah. And the access part of that really resonates for me, Kevin, because even though I don’t have a physical disability, I marvel at how many times I encounter places just in my travels. And I don’t necessarily mean going to an airport. I mean just doing life, getting out of the house. I’ll call that travel. Where the entrance is a stairway and there’s no Access for someone who’s in a wheelchair. And I realize it would probably take a lot to reconfigure every single building that exists on the planet, but there are some public settings that really do need that. So to your point, we’ve made progress and there’s room for improvement.
Bernie Borges [00:25:00]:
And so thank you for your service as a volunteer for and heading up the board for Access Living.
Kevin Bradley [00:25:07]:
Well, the other thing to note is oftentimes accommodations that are made for individuals with disabilities get used quite a bit by non disabled individuals. And you take your example of getting into a building, an accessible door, a door with an automatic plate that automatically opens. That’s wonderful for someone in a wheelchair. But think about a parent pushing a baby carriage, or you’ve got arms full of groceries or laptops or whatever, and now you’re trying to manage opening a very heavy door. So it’s just been so interesting seeing that the number of accommodations that were designed for individuals with disabilities are actually used universally.
Bernie Borges [00:25:51]:
So, Kevin, we have covered a lot of ground in our 30 or so minutes together in this conversation around culture and belonging and inclusivity. So before I ask you for your contact information for the listener to connect with you, you want to give us a key takeaway for the listener from this conversation.
Kevin Bradley [00:26:08]:
You know, I think a couple of things and I was thinking about this. I teach a Japanese martial art called aikido, which interestingly enough, loosely translate to the way of harmony. But there are two sayings that I’ve heard often in doing this art that I know I’ve carried with me. And it’s really helped me through having work, life, harmony, and being fulfilled. But one of them is fall down seven times, get up eight. And then the other is even monkeys fall out of trees. So those I even had them up on my wall as Japanese sayings. Again, those two things, sometimes I just look at them, nod my head and say, yep.
Kevin Bradley [00:26:45]:
And both have helped me quite a bit.
Bernie Borges [00:26:48]:
Yeah, those are great examples and comment that I want to make is you have. This conversation has really opened my eyes to the power of culture and belonging and how it connects to our fulfillment journey and how we can really seek fulfillment through the lens of culture, the lens of belonging, and how we treat people and being intentional about it. And so many of the examples that you shared really contribute to that. So thank you for that. Kevin, if a listener wants to connect with you and get into your world, where do you want to send them?
Kevin Bradley [00:27:24]:
I’m easy to find. I’m on LinkedIn, so that’s probably the easiest.
Bernie Borges [00:27:28]:
Okay. And your LinkedIn handle is? Kevin Bradley, the number one. But of course, that is linked up in the Show Notes page for this episode. So, Kevin, thank you so much for joining me on this episode of the Life of Phil podcast. I look forward to meeting you beyond this video in person at the HR Wellness and Executive Summit in October in Atlanta. And again, just thank you for sharing all of your wisdom and insight with us today.
Kevin Bradley [00:27:52]:
It’s been an extreme pleasure.
