Bernie Borges [00:00:00]:
Adele Curran, welcome to the Life Fulfilled podcast.
Adele Curran [00:00:04]:
Thanks so much for having me. I’m really excited to be here with you.
Bernie Borges [00:00:07]:
Well, I’m looking forward to our conversation because it’s a different topic than I’ve covered before. We’re going to discuss the skills that someone might be missing for a thriving relationship. Skills, Adele? Skills. What’s up with skills needed for a thriving relationship?
Adele Currin [00:00:27]:
Well, what’s up is that most of us don’t have the skills we need to have a thriving relationship, and they go off the rails. Rather than helping people or thinking I’m helping people by letting them continue their same old dynamics, I am really invested in helping them learn what they need so that they can have relationships that work.
Bernie Borges [00:00:49]:
So what are the most common struggles in relationships?
Adele Currin [00:00:53]:
Oh, my goodness. There’s so many. It’s really common to talk about how communication is the key to relationships. Right. And I have a similar philosophy, which is that, you know, we so often struggle with communication, but the way I go about it is quite different from what you might typically hear or learn about. So one thing, you know, that we all struggle with is how to actually let somebody else know what it is that we’re feeling, what it is we need. We struggle with listening and empathizing with each other. And so that’s a major skill we’re all missing, is communication.
Adele Currin [00:01:28]:
First and foremost, we’re missing the ability to self regulate. You know, there are a lot of different ways. Terminology you might use for this. A lot of us are missing the tools we need to regulate our emotions. And so that’s something that people really have to be taught as well. And there’s several others, but those are kind of the two buckets I put things in, like the emotional regulation and then the communication.
Bernie Borges [00:01:55]:
Okay. Before we actually get into the skills, I’m dying to have that conversation with you, Adele, and really understand what you mean by skills in a relationship. I know that you’re a relationship and communication coach. Right. How did you get there? Give us your backstory.
Adele Currin [00:02:09]:
Oh, gosh. Well, I was married quite young, and I think my story is fairly typical in that after however many years, maybe 10 years, I became really dissatisfied with my marriage. I tried everything to get it back on track. I was the person who tended to be like, the caregiver and the fixer, and I was, you know, racing around trying to fix it. I read all the books, I dragged my husband to couples counseling, and ultimately nothing worked, and I wound up getting divorced. And then on the other side of that, now it’s been almost 10 years. Looking back, I can see what I was missing and what he was missing and what we were missing together to enable our relationship to work. And so now, you know, it’s my.
Adele Currin [00:02:56]:
My purpose really is to help people, help give people what I didn’t have and what he didn’t have to help relationships actually thrive so people don’t have to go through what. What I went through.
Bernie Borges [00:03:08]:
Okay. You said that your story is. Is fairly common, and it is. Unfortunately, it is. I do hear stories similar to that. And one thing that I’ve seen you say that I really want to commend you for. Adele, I really like what you say, and that is that you say, I’m not telling you to go, meaning I’m not telling you to leave your relationship and I’m not telling you to stay. I’m telling you to figure out what’s best for you.
Bernie Borges [00:03:35]:
And I really, really like that. And I really commend you for that. So let’s use that as a segue to these skills. I want to understand these relationship skills for a little context. Adele, you know that my five pillar life strategy is health, fitness, career, relationships, and legacy. So clearly we’re talking about the relationship pillar. So let’s get into it. What are the skills that we need to build strong, long lasting, meaningful relationships?
Adele Currin [00:04:10]:
Yeah, So I will start with. You know, and honestly, the way I talk about this has evolved and keeps evolving almost every week. So sometimes I use certain words, sometimes I use other words. So I would put the. I started off talking about emotional regulation. So the very first thing I help my clients with is kind of what to do with all the emotions they have that are difficult when they’re in a relationship that’s struggling. And I start there because I find that when people come to me, they are so angry, they’re so resentful, maybe guilty, you know, a lot of other emotions, sad. You know, there are all kinds of emotions that could be going on that I really have to help people have a way of handling what’s coming up for them, because without that, things tend to go off the rails.
Adele Currin [00:05:02]:
And that’s something that I really help them with on an individual basis as opposed to I could potentially help them with it as a couple. But I find it’s really effective to work with each person one on one, first of all, so that they can. And when I say regulate their emotions, I don’t mean just staying calm all the time, being able to identify what’s coming up, how they’re feeling, learning what they actually need that’s underneath the feeling. How to soothe themselves in the moment. And why is that so important? It’s so important because let’s say you get into an argument with your spouse, which is inevitable at some point, right? Are you gonna lose it and start yelling? Are you gonna be able to, like, center yourself and calm yourself? And that’s so key. I mean, as we can all relate to, right. It’s like, when I get upset, how am I gonna handle myself? So that’s, like, the first thing I really help everybody with.
Bernie Borges [00:05:59]:
Okay, so just a little double click on that, because you answered the question that was in my head on what you mean by regulation. And so what I really think I’m hearing, Adele, is that you’re really talking about self awareness, like being aware of the emotions that we can experience in our relationship and being aware of how to manage them.
Adele Currin [00:06:23]:
Yeah, self awareness. I actually just created this new document last week for my clients about what is emotional maturity is kind of like the overview, and I broke it down. And really, the first step is awareness. Right. And that awareness is what you’re talking about. What am I feeling? At what point do I need to pause and soothe myself? So awareness is really just the first part, and then the second part is the regulation. What do I do when I notice that I’m feeling upset or triggered or whatever you want to call it? And then there are these other components which actually come in later as part of the communication. How do I listen to someone else and have empathy for them? Maybe even when I’m feeling upset? So it becomes very complex.
Adele Currin [00:07:08]:
But, yes, awareness is the place to start.
Bernie Borges [00:07:11]:
Okay. And I think it’s probably no accident that you’re beginning with emotion, Right? Because let’s face it, relationships are emotional. So let’s address that right out of the gate.
Adele Currin [00:07:24]:
Yeah, you’ve got to address it right out of the gate. And so often when people come to me, I think you were asking about the major problems in relationships. People typically, by the time they’ve gone to see a couples counselor to go to see me, they have a lot built up between them. And it usually looks like people often say we. It’s like we have a wall between us. And what’s that wall? It’s a buildup of. You could call it resentment. A buildup of hurt, anger, sadness over time.
Adele Currin [00:07:51]:
And until they learn how to manage these. This difficult feeling that’s there, that wall, then there’s nothing really you can do to make it better.
Bernie Borges [00:08:01]:
All right, so the first skill, then is emotional regulation. What’s another skill that we need.
Adele Currin [00:08:08]:
So we need. This is an actual skill, even though it’s kind of like a mindset thing too, which is the ability to take responsibility for our side of the equation. Self responsibility, basically. And this is something that most all of us lack. We weren’t taught how to do it. Most traditional couples counseling doesn’t really go there. It becomes about listening to people argue and throw each other under the bus over and over again. And blame, it becomes a blame game.
Adele Currin [00:08:40]:
So what’s so important to get out of that cycle of blaming each other is to learn to see clearly your own side of the equation. And it’s a skill because, like I said, we weren’t taught it. And so I have to. And this is something I have to very gently walk people into. Because the truth of the matter is it can be very easy, as we all know, to like, see the plank of someone else’s eye, you know, or the splinter. How did the saying go? In any case, it’s easy to see someone.
Bernie Borges [00:09:10]:
It’s biblical. Yeah.
Adele Currin [00:09:12]:
Yes. Yeah.
Bernie Borges [00:09:12]:
Pull the plank out of your own eye before you pull the plank.
Adele Currin [00:09:16]:
Yeah, yeah, yeah, exactly. So it’s so easy to see what someone else is doing. Especially when you’re with someone who might be doing that. Doing. Doing something that’s frankly kind of obnoxious. And yet there is always a part in which we’re responsible. Maybe my responsibilities. Only that I’ve put up with this for a long time and I haven’t learned how to stand up for myself.
Adele Currin [00:09:38]:
But there’s always a piece and responsibility that lies with each of us.
Bernie Borges [00:09:44]:
Yeah, I think this is a big one because I think it’s probably very common. You would know better than I as a relationship coach. But just speaking from my own life experience, Adele, it’s probably pretty common for us to be looking that way. I think there’s another old adage. It goes something like, if I’m pointing the finger at you, I’m pointing one finger at you, but there’s three fingers pointing back at me. Right. So it’s the old, you know, where do I have responsibility in this thing that I’m frustrated by?
Adele Currin [00:10:16]:
Absolutely. And you know, it’s actually a mindset I always had. Even during the marriage. I told you about that. I was struggling. And I think some of us are naturally more self reflective than others. I was always pretty self reflective. I mean, I think that’s why I like this work.
Adele Currin [00:10:31]:
And I’ve always been drawn to personal growth work, but I didn’t really have the ability to actually see my part. I would blame myself for things kind of generally without seeing where I had the opportunity to grow. And that’s really why this is so important. It’s not only that it stops the blame of the other person. It gives me an opportunity to make changes when I can see what part is my responsibility and what part is it.
Bernie Borges [00:10:57]:
Okay, so we’ve covered emotional regulation. We’ve covered the skill of taking responsibility. What’s next, Adele?
Adele Currin [00:11:07]:
So this part isn’t so much a skill, but I think it’s so important in work with relationships. So I kind of think about it as like, there are skills and then there is something that’s deeper. And I think you and I talked about it when we first met. But, you know, as we all know, if you’ve done any degree of personal growth work or therapy or whatever, we’re all carrying around an accumulated lifetime of junk, mainly that started in childhood. You know, those things that trigger you and you know, those things that we all tend to believe things about ourselves that may not be helpful. And so there’s a component of this work that’s so important that we work on this deeper underlying, you know, you could call it subconscious or unconscious stuff that we’re all carrying around. And that work is so incredibly important because until we do it, we can learn skills, and they might be useful, but the same old stuff tends to keep coming up until we work on that. So it’s not a skill per se, but it’s a really important part of the work.
Bernie Borges [00:12:17]:
So isn’t that also another form of self awareness then?
Adele Currin [00:12:21]:
It is a form of self awareness, but I would say it goes deeper than that because I would call like self awareness might be. So you can use self awareness around your triggers, right? You can say, oh, my goodness, oh, this old thing is coming up, and I know this is old and I’m getting triggered, and this is time I need to pause. Okay, so that’s a self awareness kind of strategy. Whereas when, if you’re working really on this deeper subconscious layer, the idea is when I’m getting triggered, it’s because of this old stuff is coming up and it’s triggering this old belief about myself. Maybe I’m not enough. Maybe I’m not lovable or deserving or whatever, then once we work on that on a deeper level, it may be that the trigger is still there somewhat, but it’s going to be a lot less so. Therefore, we won’t tend to have the same emotional response when the something comes up.
Bernie Borges [00:13:20]:
So what do you call this? Because I have to tell you, the way that I’m framing this up in my mind, Adele, is I’m calling this know your baggage.
Adele Currin [00:13:28]:
Yeah, no, you’re right. It’s about your baggage. But there’s a big difference between being aware of your baggage and removing some of the baggage. So the idea is, when you’re working on it on a really deep level, it’s not that it goes away entirely, but the baggage becomes a lot lighter.
Bernie Borges [00:13:45]:
Speaking for myself, because I can only speak for myself, do I really know what my baggage is? Am I willing to go deep and think about it? Am I willing to bring it to the surface? You know what I mean? Like, how are people dealing with that on their own? I mean, I realize you work with people as a relationship coach, but in general, I mean, why don’t you speak to that?
Adele Currin [00:14:10]:
Well, it’s such a good question. I mean. Well, first of all, there’s the willingness, Right? Of course, you have to be willing to. For anything to work. So the willingness, yeah, if you have to be willing for anything to work. But then willing and able are two different things. So even if you’re willing to see your baggage, you might not be able to see it on your own. And that’s where I come into play.
Adele Currin [00:14:33]:
And it can be difficult even when I’m working with someone to identify what that baggage is. But, you know, I’m trained in this, so I’m. I’m actually trained in a type of deep subconscious work where if someone comes to me and, for example, says, here’s my pattern, I tend to fly off the handle whenever my wife mentions. I don’t know, let’s say money. You know, whenever my wife spends more than I want her to at the grocery store, I fly off the handle. I scream and yell. I completely freak out. And this has been a pattern my whole life.
Adele Currin [00:15:08]:
I remember when I was a kid when my dad would do the same thing with my mom or whatever. So what I could help that person do is while once you can identify a pattern, then you have an entry point. Okay, now we can look at what to really work on. And I don’t necessarily need to know what it is, because when we do this type of deep, subconscious work together, it basically all comes out, and it ends up being some kind of fear. So that person who flies off the handle about money might have grown up in a situation where they never had enough money and there was a lot of scarcity, and they were always afraid. And so for that person, maybe the thing we need to work on isn’t so much like their communication skills as it is his deep underlying fear of not having enough money. So once that fear becomes a little less, then he’s not going to fly up or handle in the same way. Does that make sense?
Bernie Borges [00:16:02]:
Yeah. So what I’m getting out of that is that it is deep. It is something that we have to come to understand, a very deep emotional level. And I still use the phrase baggage because it is something that we’ve carried with us for quite some time. We just may or may not be aware of it totally.
Adele Currin [00:16:22]:
And we all have baggage. I mean that’s the thing, we all have it. And in, in our closest relationships, that’s when that old stuff comes out. When we’re single, you know, and there’s no one, you know, bothering us and you know, we get to live in our little bubble, it’s easy. And when we’re living with someone, we’re committed to them. That is when people, I don’t know if you’ve heard this expression, relationships are mirror. They’re going to end up showing us our stuff, they’re going to end up showing us what we need to work on.
Bernie Borges [00:16:53]:
Okay, so just to kind of keep flowing on the skills we’ve talked about emotional regulation, taking responsibility, your baggage and having an awareness around that. What’s next? What’s another skill?
Adele Currin [00:17:05]:
So, so the broad skill I would say is this communication piece. And this all works together. You can’t really separate these skills out because the emotional regulation cannot be separate from the communication. Because if you think about it, you can learn the right words to say. But if you’re saying the words with an undertone of anger and resentment, it’s just not going to work. There is a component of communication that I really have to teach people because we’ve never learned it about how to speak to someone in a way that is, and this, this is actually reflecting back on the self responsibility piece. We need to learn to speak to someone in a way in which we’re taking responsibility for what we’re feeling and what it is we’re needing. And then maybe asking our partner if they’re willing to give us is something that we need as opposed to what we normally do, which is speak in a way that unintentionally may come across as critical or demanding and then things go off the rails from there.
Adele Currin [00:18:10]:
So the communication, it’s multi layered, it’s regulating myself, it’s taking responsibility, it’s speaking in a way that takes responsibility, it’s asking not demanding. And then there’s this other side of communication, which is all about how I’m going to listen to you, to my partner, when you’re upset and learning to have empathy for what that other person’s experiencing. Even if. And this is the really hard part, I might want to become defensive or say, I didn’t actually do that, or you’re wrong or, you know, so that is something that really has to be taught. And once people learn it, it really up levels relationship. I know for me, it’s been a game changer.
Bernie Borges [00:18:50]:
Yeah. So I was waiting for this one, Adele, because as you said, it’s huge. And I kind of view it as overarching. Right. Like it even is overarching. Emotional regulation and taking responsibility and baggage, because communication is part of that. I have always said that communication is the hardest thing we do in life. And I mean in life.
Bernie Borges [00:19:13]:
And when you think about life, life is both in work and out of work. Right. We spend a lot of time at work, so we’re communicating, but we spend time, of course, outside of work. And nonetheless, it’s no less important. And I’ve always said it’s the hardest thing we do in life. And I like the fact that you. If I understand correctly, you’re saying that part of communication is listening. Knowing how to listen and engage in the communication process, not just outbound, but also inbound as well.
Bernie Borges [00:19:45]:
Am I hearing that right?
Adele Currin [00:19:47]:
Absolutely. And I think when people talk about communication, they’re usually thinking just about the outbound, like, what are the words I’m saying? And that, I mean, I would say it’s even more important to develop the skill of the inbound. How am I going to be with someone else when they’re in pain or when they are angry with me or when they have requests of me? And that part is absolutely huge. And you’re right, it’s probably one of the hardest things we do. And there’s so much that goes into it. And we’re constantly communicating. You and I are communicating right now. We communicate with our children, with our coworkers.
Adele Currin [00:20:27]:
And here is something that most of us are missing. And this is where I start with all my clients. We’re communicating constantly with ourselves. So, you know, we have this little voice that’s always talking to us. Right. You know, and sometimes there’s two voices that are talking to each other. And that’s where we have to start. Because until we can communicate with ourselves better, we can’t really communicate with anyone else better either.
Bernie Borges [00:20:52]:
Yeah. There’s a concept That I learned many years ago that has really been helpful to me on communication, and that is that there’s two parts to it. There’s sending and receiving. So like you said, we’re having a conversation. So when I’m communicating as I am right now, I’m sending words, and I’m intending to make a point. You are receiving them. And so I need to be aware if you’re receiving them with the intention that I had. Because if you didn’t, good chance that I.
Bernie Borges [00:21:28]:
I’m, you know, back to taking responsibility. Good chance. It’s not your fault. It’s my fault. Meaning I intended to say A, you heard B. B, I probably didn’t communicate A very well, and that concept has helped me a lot.
Adele Currin [00:21:46]:
That’s a huge problem, what you’re talking about. And we have so many misunderstandings with each other, and we make so many assumptions about what the other person is understanding, what the other person’s thinking. And the communication sort of framework I work with is called nonviolent communication. It’s just a particular style. It’s not the only one, but it’s the one I know about, and I really, really like. There is a part of the communication process where we check in with each other and we basically make a request for understanding. You know, I said something to you, and then I’ll say, and, bernie, would you mind letting me know what you understood from what I just said? And that part’s so important because you’re right. Otherwise we.
Adele Currin [00:22:28]:
You might walk away thinking you made. You were perfectly clear.
Bernie Borges [00:22:31]:
Mm.
Adele Currin [00:22:31]:
And you may not have been.
Bernie Borges [00:22:33]:
Exactly.
Adele Currin [00:22:33]:
So, yeah, it’s really important.
Bernie Borges [00:22:35]:
Okay. We’ve covered a lot of important skills. Here are the. Any others that we need to know about for relationships?
Adele Currin [00:22:43]:
You know, those are kind of the bit. Those are the big buckets. And, you know, there’s so many techniques and strategies and building blocks to get to a place of being a great communicator and being able to regulate your emotions and take responsibility. But I would say those are the big buckets.
Bernie Borges [00:22:59]:
And I’m wondering when you work as a relationship and communication coach, and I love the fact that you’ve got both relationship and communication in your identity role, because they go together. Right. As we’ve just been discussing.
Adele Currin [00:23:11]:
Oh, I’ll be talking.
Bernie Borges [00:23:13]:
I’m wondering, because this is what’s running through my mind, Adele. And that is. I’m asking myself, are these skills or are they habits? And I’m not here, like, argue the semantics, but I’m just wondering from the work that you do with clients is do people generally think of these as skills? Do they embrace them as skills, or do they embrace them as lifestyle or habits or whatever the vernacular might be?
Adele Currin [00:23:41]:
Good question. I’m actually, you know, I’m kind of obsessed with habits. And I started my coach training, actually as a health coach, and it was all about helping people build healthy habits. And so when I started working with relationships, I thought, oh, you know, we need healthy habits in relationships just like we do around our health. Right. We need you. Just like you’ve got in a habit of going to the gym every day and eating a certain, you know, and going to bed at a certain time. And really, that’s a problem in our relationship.
Adele Currin [00:24:16]:
We have bad habits. So I like that you picked up on that. So I think about it. A skill might be something you learn. So if you think about driving, right, when you don’t know how to drive, you first have to develop the skill of driving. And when you’re first learning something new, it’s clunky and you have to. I remember when I learned to drive, I’d have to think about it every time I pulled up the intersection. Like, which way? Wait, which side is the blinker? You know, when it’s clunky.
Adele Currin [00:24:44]:
But then after a while, you drive for many years. You don’t have to think about it anymore. It does become a habit. So the skill then becomes a habit. So I think those terms are kind of interchangeable. I’m just thinking about a skill as something like we’re teaching, and then hopefully you practice the skill enough time, it becomes a habit.
Bernie Borges [00:25:03]:
Thank you for that distinction. And that makes sense. That makes sense. You do have to develop a skill, and then it becomes a habit. Good. I like that. I like that.
Adele Currin [00:25:11]:
Yeah. Yeah. And I just as like just building on that for a second. One thing I emphasize with my clients is this isn’t like we’re going to therapy once a week and you talk and that’s it. Or, you know, you go to church once a week and then you forget everything for the rest of the week. That doesn’t work because I do want them to learn a habit. So part of what I really emphasize with my clients is helping them practice. So I give them some kind of practice every day.
Adele Currin [00:25:39]:
We practice together. They practice with each other. They practice on their own because otherwise you’re going to never learn the skill. You’re never. It’s never going to become a habit.
Bernie Borges [00:25:47]:
So you give them homework?
Adele Currin [00:25:48]:
I do give them. Correct. Correct.
Bernie Borges [00:25:52]:
Do you grade them?
Adele Currin [00:25:54]:
Absolutely not. No.
Bernie Borges [00:25:56]:
And, you know, I didn’t mean it literally, being a little facetious, but, I mean, you. You have conversation about it, right?
Adele Currin [00:26:02]:
Oh, of course. So part of what I think the distinction between coaching and traditional therapy is it coaches hold their clients accountable, and what use is it for us to learn something new if they’re going to not do it and then come back the next week and start on something else? So I do hold them accountable. I don’t beat them up. But if something doesn’t, you know, they say, I didn’t do my thing this week, then we’ll talk about it. Okay, well, what was preventing you from doing it? What was that resistance about? And maybe it’s as simple as they need to structure their day differently so they get to bed early so they can wake. So then they can wake up early and do their meditation or their. Whatever it was that they were supposed to be doing. But, yeah, I helped them figure out what was standing in the way.
Bernie Borges [00:26:46]:
Okay, great. Well, we’ve covered a lot of ground, and I love this topic. This is a big topic because obviously, relationships are everything in life, right? We. We just have so many relationships. Of course, we’re primarily. We’ve been talking about the main relationship between two people, whether it’s a marriage or a significant other. And. And unfortunately, too many of those relationships fail.
Bernie Borges [00:27:10]:
So. You’re doing great work, Adele, and I love the fact that you’ve got a. A very structured approach to it with training and helping a lot of people. So why don’t you tell my listener where they can connect with you, get into your world. If there’s a particular resource you want to make them aware of, please share that.
Adele Currin [00:27:28]:
Sure. So you can find me on Instagram. It’s. It’s just my name at Adele Curran. Facebook is the same. My website, everything is just my name. My website is www.adelecurren.com. and on my website, and also in my bio on Instagram, there’s a free resource that is really kind of an introduction to this communication style I’m talking about.
Adele Currin [00:27:53]:
It’s basically about how to ask your partner for what you really need. And doing that, you know, in a way that’s more likely to build connection than distance, which is what often happens. So, yeah, would love to connect with any of you who listened to this and found it intriguing.
Bernie Borges [00:28:09]:
Fantastic. Well, Adele, my listener knows that all that would be linked up in the show notes for this episode. And I just want to thank you for coming on this episode of the Life Fulfilled podcast and sharing your wisdom, your insights on relationship management and the skills that we need to manage our relationships. So thank you so much, Adele.
Adele Currin [00:28:29]:
Thanks so much for having me.
